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How come NO ONE is talking about 38 tourist killed by ISIS militant in Tunisia??

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  1. #61

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    Is he justifying it or just suggesting that they are probably linked. Isn't he just questioning if there was no ongoing drone campaign would the attack happened? No where does he 'justify' the killing that I can see only that it may be an outcome influenced by other events.
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  2. #62

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    Its not nice to kills tens of thousands, but WMD.
    Its not nice to maim millions, but democracy.
    Its not nice to carpet bomb, but communism.

    Why is it accepted when its done by the regime on behalf of its people
    but its unacceptable when its done by s single person that does not represent his entire religion?

  3. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by HowardCoombs:
    Its not nice to kills tens of thousands, but WMD.
    Its not nice to maim millions, but democracy.
    Its not nice to carpet bomb, but communism.

    Why is it accepted when its done by the regime on behalf of its people
    but its unacceptable when its done by s single person that does not represent his entire religion?
    democracy?

  4. #64

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    Unfortunately I would suggest until socio-economic issues are solved then grievances will fester. The Marshall plan after the WWII probably did more for world peace than most other actions.
    Last edited by East_coast; 30-06-2015 at 08:47 AM.

  5. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by HowardCoombs:
    An apologist is in the eye of the beholder.

    Attempt to understand why something has happened : you're an apologist.
    Attempt to separate the nutter from his religion and millions of others : you're an apologist.
    Attempt to study the historical transgressions that have led to the current point : you're an apologist.
    Bring up comparative arguments where the other side has killed tens of thousands : you're an apologist.
    Point out that the beholder is biased or is slightly unhinged : you're an apologist.

    Wash, rinse and repeat.....
    Not to mention strawmen...

  6. #66

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    Apologies. I must have misread your post. It seemed that you found it offensive that someone was saying his God was involved after the death of someone he considered to be an enemy.

  7. #67

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    TigerSun, personally I don't buy the "It's all the West's fault" line and from reading some of what he says I think Greenwald is an egotistical pompous twat who revels in people misunderstanding him, provokes it to get a reaction. However, the West IS part of the problem from it's killing of innocent children to it's support of Israel whatever they do, to it's cozying up to Saudi Arabia. He is right that there are double standards applied. We share the outrage when 38 innocent tourists are killed in Tunisia but seem to find it hard to share the outrage when innocent children are killed by a drone and don't acknowledge the outrage that causes in the countries affected and the further recruitment of extremists it causes. So I think he is a bit of a twat but don't think he is excusing the atrocities, he is just seeing the atrocities on both sides.

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  8. #68

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    Good list on the specific issue.

    I would suggest more generically that the problem lies mainly in poverty which leads to lack of education (so the "church" is the only place offering free education, no different here to middle ages europe) and poverty means despair (which leaves people open to suggestions from said "church").

    The solution here is poverty reduction, improvements in infrastructure, global trade reform, improved Governance in poor countries ... all the kind of things the world bank, ADB and others are trying to do (with very limited success). None of it is overnight solutions. But well educated, well fed, happy people with bright futures do not (generally) go around killing people.

    QED.
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  9. #69

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    Quote Originally Posted by HK_Katherine:
    I would suggest more generically that the problem lies mainly in poverty which leads to lack of education (so the "church" is the only place offering free education, no different here to middle ages europe) and poverty means despair (which leaves people open to suggestions from said "church").

    The solution here is poverty reduction, improvements in infrastructure, global trade reform, improved Governance in poor countries ... all the kind of things the world bank, ADB and others are trying to do (with very limited success). None of it is overnight solutions. But well educated, well fed, happy people with bright futures do not (generally) go around killing people.

    QED.
    The best post so far.

    Perhaps the other issue is the lack of separation of religion and the executive branch of government in many of the failed or near failing states. The political leaders then use the power of religion to instill draconian laws and meter out totalitarianesque punishments.

    From the below article 'Under the Ottoman empire, just one person was stoned to death in 600 years.'

    By the book | The Economist

    So poor governance resulting in poverty and hunger combined with corrupt leadership leveraging the power of religion to stay in positions of power.

    Saying that for the case of the gunman in the Beach it could be just like the many American tragedies of having far too easy access to guns in society and someone becoming mentally deranged.
    Last edited by East_coast; 04-07-2015 at 08:01 AM.
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  10. #70

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    Quote Originally Posted by HK_Katherine:
    Good list on the specific issue.

    I would suggest more generically that the problem lies mainly in poverty which leads to lack of education (so the "church" is the only place offering free education, no different here to middle ages europe) and poverty means despair (which leaves people open to suggestions from said "church").

    The solution here is poverty reduction, improvements in infrastructure, global trade reform, improved Governance in poor countries ... all the kind of things the world bank, ADB and others are trying to do (with very limited success). None of it is overnight solutions. But well educated, well fed, happy people with bright futures do not (generally) go around killing people.

    QED.
    I absolutely agree with you. In the meantime the killings go on. This is the reverse of the 'What about The Crusades' argument...I'm sure Islam will eventually fade and lose power as is happening with Christianity...but what about NOW?

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